Entrepreneurs: Imposter Syndrome

[00:00:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Hello everyone, I'm Andy coming to you from the United Kingdom

[00:00:24] [SPEAKER_01]: And making my way through the dog days of summer in Toronto. I'm your other host Scott

[00:00:30] [SPEAKER_00]: Very good to see you again, Scott. This is the Tea and Timbits podcast global perspectives on business development to help you prosper

[00:00:39] [SPEAKER_00]: How's the summer been treating you so far, Scott?

[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_01]: It's been very good. The weather has been summery, which we had wildfires last summer in Canada across the board and we actually had to cancel outdoor activities because of all the smoke

[00:00:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Now listen there, there have still been some devastating fires this year. The town of Jasper in Alberta has burnt to the ground. It's been absolutely terrible

[00:01:09] [SPEAKER_01]: That's been an isolated thing though. So it's been good to be able to get out and enjoy all of our usual routines and activities

[00:01:18] [SPEAKER_01]: And I hope that it just stays around a little bit longer this year

[00:01:24] [SPEAKER_00]: We've certainly had an odd summer. Well, I suppose it's a very British summer this year

[00:01:30] [SPEAKER_00]: It's been wet and rainy and cold and everyone's complaining it's really awful summer because it's too wet and rainy

[00:01:38] [SPEAKER_00]: And then the next day it will be hot and sunny and everyone will complain that it's too hot and too sunny

[00:01:44] [SPEAKER_00]: It's just the British way

[00:01:46] [SPEAKER_01]: Is it British to talk about the weather? Because it's very canine

[00:01:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah. Yeah, we like to talk about the weather and we like to join queues

[00:01:54] [SPEAKER_01]: I'll send you a picture. We've had a deluge of rain this year as well. Same thing like it just comes down hard or not at all

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_01]: I'll send you some interesting pictures of the streets of Toronto

[00:02:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you very much

[00:02:07] [SPEAKER_00]: We can also post them on our socials I guess

[00:02:11] [SPEAKER_00]: Very exciting stories of the weather in Canada and in the UK

[00:02:17] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think this week we're going to continue our episodes on entrepreneurship and startups and being a success

[00:02:27] [SPEAKER_00]: But we're going to focus this week on the imposter syndrome, which is something that affects many people

[00:02:36] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure that I'm the right person to be able to talk about it

[00:02:39] [SPEAKER_00]: Who am I to have an opinion on these sort of things? But we'll give it a go anyway

[00:02:45] [SPEAKER_00]: However, before we get to that

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Do you have a story for us?

[00:02:48] [SPEAKER_01]: I do. If I didn't do some of this other business mentoring, I probably wouldn't have a much smaller story bank

[00:02:57] [SPEAKER_01]: So I was working with some other entrepreneurs recently and they produced these business plans

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_01]: And then they got other business leaders to review them and comment and whatnot

[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_01]: And so one particular person and this is a really extreme example, but I thought it'd be great to sort of

[00:03:14] [SPEAKER_01]: illustrate a point. So

[00:03:16] [SPEAKER_01]: I get the business name, I get the business owner's name, their contact information and then I get their business plan

[00:03:24] [SPEAKER_01]: And so I read just the tombstone information

[00:03:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Who are you? What's your name? Whatever. I googled them, I looked them up

[00:03:30] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like okay, I've got some contacts in my head

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_01]: I opened the business plan and I was I was like, oh

[00:03:37] [SPEAKER_01]: They must have attached the wrong business plan to this business name and this person

[00:03:43] [SPEAKER_01]: And then I looked a little deeper at the business plan. I'm like no it's the same person

[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_01]: And so I was like okay well maybe

[00:03:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe they just sort of submitted through the legal entity that they had established and they're starting a new business

[00:04:02] [SPEAKER_01]: and because honestly the existing business and the business plan

[00:04:09] [SPEAKER_01]: were using related technologies but were completely different businesses, completely different business models, completely different strategies

[00:04:19] [SPEAKER_01]: It's just you know you can use a drone it was they were using drones you can use a drone to

[00:04:26] [SPEAKER_01]: survey different things or you can use it to do light shows in the sky

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_01]: and so that's essentially the contrast and then I got on the call

[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like I need just need some clarification like you're doing and it all fell into place

[00:04:46] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like oh I get what's happened here is that you have an understanding of this technology

[00:04:51] [SPEAKER_01]: You want to apply it to a different industry and then by the end of the call

[00:04:57] [SPEAKER_01]: we had pivoted again to what I think is probably a better place but I said you know

[00:05:03] [SPEAKER_01]: I can tell you know a lot about the technology and different ways you can apply it

[00:05:10] [SPEAKER_01]: Instead of applying it to the place that you currently are excited about

[00:05:17] [SPEAKER_01]: What about having a service business or position yourself as a consultant to anybody that has this technology

[00:05:24] [SPEAKER_01]: and wants to use it in their industry and then that allows you to be an expert in the technology

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_01]: how to use it, how to set it up, how to maintain it, you know what accessories or instruments you need on it

[00:05:37] [SPEAKER_01]: and then being able to adapt that to you know the industry that your customer is in

[00:05:42] [SPEAKER_01]: And it just like they were like holy crap that's exactly what I want to do

[00:05:50] [SPEAKER_01]: So anyway the interesting story don't be so schizophrenic about some of these things

[00:05:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Be really intentional get some you know on the point that we made in our last episode

[00:06:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Don't just sit in your desk and write business plans socialize it which this person had done

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Like obviously by talking to me and getting involved in this program was doing all the right things

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_01]: But I thought it was just an interesting story we're sharing there

[00:06:17] [SPEAKER_00]: No definitely definitely and I think that's that ties in quite a lot with what we're talking about anyway now

[00:06:24] [SPEAKER_00]: is the you know the whole being prepared to evolve, being prepared to open up listen to advice

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_00]: take that advice and apply it as applicable to your business

[00:06:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Not maybe necessarily changing the business all the time but getting that feedback from an outside perspective

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_00]: seeking that feedback from an outside perspective and then

[00:06:47] [SPEAKER_00]: considering how that can be applied and you know using that to hopefully to the advantage of the business overall

[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_00]: But today yeah we're going to be talking about the imposter syndrome which obviously is that persistent feeling of being a fraud

[00:07:05] [SPEAKER_00]: despite all of the evidence to the contrary

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think we all can suffer from it from time to time and whatever it is that we're doing

[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_00]: And it can be simple things like putting out social media post

[00:07:17] [SPEAKER_00]: Why should I be recording a social media post on on on sales success?

[00:07:22] [SPEAKER_00]: You know who am I to do that and you know I think we both probably felt it before we started doing this podcast as well

[00:07:29] [SPEAKER_00]: You know who are we to talk about business development?

[00:07:31] [SPEAKER_00]: You know why should we be talking about it and yet it's something we've been doing our whole lives

[00:07:36] [SPEAKER_00]: So what are your thoughts on on how you know

[00:07:41] [SPEAKER_00]: What should people get from this discussion?

[00:07:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so just I hope a little bit of confidence and reflection about overcoming some of those hurdles that are in front of them

[00:07:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Those sort of mental blocks that that do hold you back from those

[00:07:59] [SPEAKER_01]: From doing some good fun things that you're probably pretty passionate or excited to pursue

[00:08:04] [SPEAKER_01]: So it's just a confidence booster. I hope yeah

[00:08:08] [SPEAKER_00]: What would you say were common signs of imposter syndrome so people can identify that they are suffering from it because sometimes people that don't know that they are

[00:08:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'll reiterate some of the points that you just you just made and and I would say that in my very early entrepreneurial journey personally

[00:08:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Like it probably you know, we've had our own business for over 20 20 years

[00:08:35] [SPEAKER_01]: It's only been in the last probably five or six years that we've really sort of gained

[00:08:41] [SPEAKER_01]: The confidence to put ourselves out there more and more intentionally more loudly

[00:08:50] [SPEAKER_01]: And you could argue that like well, that's because now you have 15 years of experience and you have something to talk about

[00:08:56] [SPEAKER_01]: But it is that's not it at all. It was it was certainly like okay fine

[00:09:00] [SPEAKER_01]: I have the confidence because I I've seen the same themes come up time and time again and they're as old as time and therefore they

[00:09:11] [SPEAKER_01]: They're unsolvable or they're so recurring and my experience is something I can draw from to tell the story

[00:09:19] [SPEAKER_01]: But it wouldn't have been any different if I had started a podcast 15 years ago or

[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_01]: The content marketing that we do or some of the mentoring or or whatnot

[00:09:30] [SPEAKER_01]: So it is definitely that sense that well there are so many people out there that are saying the same thing or that are better educated or

[00:09:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Are more established than I and who am I to

[00:09:45] [SPEAKER_01]: You know enter that even even enter that conversation. Yeah, and I think that that is

[00:09:53] [SPEAKER_00]: You know really what you know imposter symptoms all though for me. Yeah, I mean I think that's exactly it

[00:10:02] It's

[00:10:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think I think is that that sort of self doubt and

[00:10:07] [SPEAKER_00]: You know attributing your success to luck, you know things like that and stuff and

[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_00]: Just thinking along those lines is

[00:10:17] [SPEAKER_00]: It's very typical, you know creative people entrepreneurs. It's it's very very common

[00:10:23] [SPEAKER_00]: For people to suffer it and I think I think as well that sometimes when people get that feeling and they become aware that they've got this imposter syndrome

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_00]: They often think that they're alone in that feeling as well and that they are it's just them who you know who's experiencing this which you know then feeds that fire

[00:10:38] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think in order to overcome it. I mean what would you what would you say are some some clever things that can be done

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_00]: To to do that and from my perspective, I did just just carry on a little bit out there

[00:10:53] [SPEAKER_00]: I think it really starts with embracing your achievements and and recognizing and regularly sort of

[00:11:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Keeping a journal of the milestones and challenges that you've overcome because by doing that that that can really

[00:11:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Boost your confidence and give you that that continued reflection

[00:11:15] [SPEAKER_00]: Which then reduces the possibility of you falling into that trap of imposter syndrome when you have to go and do something

[00:11:21] [SPEAKER_00]: You know someone invites you to go and do a speech you get invited as a guest on a podcast

[00:11:25] [SPEAKER_00]: Someone asked you to make us, you know a social media video with them or do a LinkedIn live

[00:11:31] [SPEAKER_00]: People feel more confident about it because they they know themselves. They go. Oh, yeah, actually I have achieved some stuff

[00:11:37] [SPEAKER_00]: I have done some good things. I have done the right thing and it allows people to sort of shift their mindset in a way

[00:11:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Right

[00:11:44] [SPEAKER_01]: I would agree with that for sure. I think that it's just recognizing that you have had

[00:11:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Whatever in your life if it has if it goes back to school days or or community development or whatever family life

[00:12:00] [SPEAKER_01]: There are successes that we've all been able to achieve and they they transfer

[00:12:07] [SPEAKER_01]: There's a there's a there's an accomplishment there

[00:12:10] [SPEAKER_01]: You may not know the intricacies of heart surgery, but you might know how to you know schedule really well or in you know rally people

[00:12:20] [SPEAKER_01]: On on a team you might need to go learn some heart skills if you want to go into heart surgery

[00:12:24] [SPEAKER_01]: But my point is that you'll have a lot more strength and confidence

[00:12:31] [SPEAKER_01]: If you can rely on some of those other successes that you just talked about

[00:12:36] [SPEAKER_01]: I also think it is about remembering that the audience that you have is unique to you

[00:12:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes very true

[00:12:46] [SPEAKER_01]: And so yeah, sure there are lots of other people that talk about business development being entrepreneurs

[00:12:51] [SPEAKER_01]: You know sales and so on and so forth

[00:12:54] [SPEAKER_01]: But you know, I've never talked to anybody else about it like the way I talked to you about it Andy and so

[00:13:00] [SPEAKER_01]: you know

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just here to help you in your career

[00:13:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Because I don't know what else is listening to our podcast

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_01]: The the the audience that that surrounds you is surrounding you for a reason. They're at the very least friends

[00:13:18] [SPEAKER_01]: colleagues

[00:13:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and they will appreciate that you've thought about

[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_01]: You've aggregated you've distilled and reorganized some of those thoughts

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_01]: And and communicated to them

[00:13:38] [SPEAKER_01]: And that therefore is coming to them from a trusted source

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_01]: So it may not be terribly unique but it is it is coming to you in your audience and you're adding value there and

[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I can't remember who said there's no such thing as a brand new idea

[00:13:53] [SPEAKER_01]: But just because somebody else has said it or has a stronger backing in it does not mean you are therefore not qualified

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly. It's it's really about reframing that mindset isn't it? You know, it's that that positive self-talk

[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_00]: The just reminding yourself that it's not a case of I'm not good enough but instead say to yourself

[00:14:17] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm constantly improving there you go. Yeah, so but but shifting that you know, I'm not good enough

[00:14:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, maybe you're not where you think you should be but you the fact is you are constantly improving and

[00:14:30] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, there's also we touched on it earlier on in some of our other episodes about mindfulness

[00:14:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Meditation, you know being grounded being focused. I think that's important

[00:14:42] [SPEAKER_00]: But there's one other thing that you just made me think of when you said that

[00:14:48] [SPEAKER_00]: That we don't talk

[00:14:49] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, we don't necessarily talk to other people about business development in the same way we talk to each other about it

[00:14:55] [SPEAKER_00]: Is that seek a mentor?

[00:14:58] [SPEAKER_00]: Having having a mentor who's faced similar challenges and you can learn from their experiences and their insights

[00:15:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Can also give you that confidence and also help you to you know to to feel

[00:15:11] [SPEAKER_00]: That you're not alone and that you are

[00:15:14] [SPEAKER_00]: You are knowledgeable in your own area because you know

[00:15:18] [SPEAKER_00]: If you join, you know entrepreneur groups mastermind groups or you have a mentor

[00:15:23] [SPEAKER_00]: You're going to experience other people who've had similar challenges to you

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_00]: But don't have the same experiences of you and that you can also then provide value to them to help them

[00:15:33] [SPEAKER_00]: And that will boost your confidence immensely and take away the chances of you having imposter syndrome

[00:15:39] [SPEAKER_01]: I like that it goes back to the conversation in our last episode as well

[00:15:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Just kind of validating your ideas and talking to people about them to get that that feedback and you might find out that

[00:15:49] [SPEAKER_01]: It's been so overdone. It's not

[00:15:53] [SPEAKER_01]: But but it'll it'll it'll just sort of show you where you can also find your lane and where you you do have a unique perspective

[00:16:00] [SPEAKER_01]: That's worth sharing and at least for a particular audience

[00:16:04] [SPEAKER_01]: I guess the final thing I would say is

[00:16:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Who cares so what

[00:16:11] [SPEAKER_01]: There's a certain detachment that that you can benefit from if you're like, you know what I there might be other people saying that

[00:16:18] [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm passionate about this. I

[00:16:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Want to talk about it so I'm gonna

[00:16:24] [SPEAKER_01]: Or I'm or I'm gonna pursue this and you might be pursuing something that somebody else has done but you may have

[00:16:31] [SPEAKER_01]: More energy for it and that person may be willing to pass the torch or that person, you know

[00:16:40] [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe just riding on coach who knows

[00:16:42] [SPEAKER_01]: So sometimes you just you just need to let it happen and you don't and you should try to

[00:16:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Set aside those

[00:16:51] [SPEAKER_01]: hesitations and uncertainties

[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely, absolutely. I just want to say one more thing before we conclude this episode that if you are leading a team of people

[00:17:00] [SPEAKER_00]: It's also very important and as touches on our previous series in July

[00:17:06] [SPEAKER_00]: That there's an important of an importance in creating a supportive work culture and a working environment

[00:17:14] [SPEAKER_00]: because if you can celebrate the little wins and you can

[00:17:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Embrace the successes that the team are having this will reduce your team members

[00:17:24] [SPEAKER_00]: fear and

[00:17:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Anxiety and their own potential imposter syndrome and it will allow them to feel more confident to go out there and represent you

[00:17:33] [SPEAKER_00]: Your company and your brand in a more meaningful and more balanced way that gives them and everyone else

[00:17:40] [SPEAKER_00]: You know a happier work life balance as well because they'll be mentally more confident with work more comfortable with

[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Talking about things and more comfortable with being able to switch off and relax you you just hit on something

[00:17:52] [SPEAKER_01]: That's again, probably its own episode but

[00:17:55] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I was coming at this topic kind of from the entrepreneur perspective

[00:17:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Like I've got this idea. I want to do this thing

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_01]: But who am I to bring it forward or something like that?

[00:18:05] [SPEAKER_01]: but

[00:18:06] [SPEAKER_01]: I've seen in the business development world people come on they they get they get interviewed and they

[00:18:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Convince that they have these selling skills and capabilities, but then they just cannot

[00:18:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Properly embrace the brand that they have been hired to represent and

[00:18:25] [SPEAKER_01]: I think a lot of that is a certain amount of imposter syndrome

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, Moley like I squeaked through I found this job or you know

[00:18:33] [SPEAKER_01]: I I I can do what I can do and I'm excited to enter this market

[00:18:37] [SPEAKER_01]: But I actually don't didn't go to engineering school or didn't go to business school

[00:18:43] [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't know it as well as all the other people that are you know that I work with

[00:18:49] [SPEAKER_01]: And that I've seen

[00:18:51] [SPEAKER_01]: I

[00:18:53] [SPEAKER_01]: Holds back business development

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_01]: professionals who just kind of feel like they're

[00:19:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Disingenuously representing what it is that that they sell. That's right. That's right. So do you feel that we've

[00:19:07] [SPEAKER_00]: concluded this topic

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Come up with some good points and hopefully given some people some things to think about to improve their confidence around

[00:19:16] [SPEAKER_01]: those moments when they just don't feel like

[00:19:20] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, they they should they should stand where they are. Yeah

[00:19:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's very good

[00:19:25] [SPEAKER_00]: But if you're listening and you want to get in touch give us some feedback

[00:19:29] [SPEAKER_00]: Ask any further questions then please feel free to reach out on our social media where you'll find us

[00:19:37] [SPEAKER_00]: On most of the platforms

[00:19:38] [SPEAKER_00]: but also you can go to tea and timbits.com where you'll find connections to all of those social medias and

[00:19:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Contact information and ways to sign up and listen to future and past episodes of the podcast

[00:19:53] [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks Andy. Thank you very much Scott